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Old June 26th, 2017, 11:29 AM   #41
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I've been considering alternatives. Though, now that mine is "totalled" (still perfectly ride-able with about $800 of parts) I may just keep it.

Do I look at a better built/more useful bike like the 800GS or the Tiger 800 or the Africa Twin? Or do I keep my bike that I'm soon to be mostly repaid for and just beat the shit out of it... The Duc is now covered in scratches which is perfect as a travel mule. The thought of having little to nothing invested in it is nice. However, it is not a great travel or off road bike.

I have yet to actually go and test drive any other models but will be this summer.
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Old June 26th, 2017, 12:17 PM   #42
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I Ride: 13' Hyperstrada, 00' M900Sie
Quote:
Originally Posted by beef tits View Post
I've been considering alternatives. Though, now that mine is "totalled" (still perfectly ride-able with about $800 of parts) I may just keep it.

Do I look at a better built/more useful bike like the 800GS or the Tiger 800 or the Africa Twin? Or do I keep my bike that I'm soon to be mostly repaid for and just beat the shit out of it... The Duc is now covered in scratches which is perfect as a travel mule. The thought of having little to nothing invested in it is nice. However, it is not a great travel or off road bike.

I have yet to actually go and test drive any other models but will be this summer.
I was not a fan of the Tiger 800. Seemed super wimpy and uninspiring. Didn't seem to have any huge reason to have one instead of the hyper. I'd have liked to try the AT though. I hate Honda but I'd own an Africa Twin for sure.
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Old June 26th, 2017, 12:51 PM   #43
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The problem with the AT is it's incredibly dull even though its a very good motorcycle. The same applies to my VStrom 650. For me a motorcycle has to have some violence to it... the way you feel the road, the way the engine delivers power. The challenge is finding a bike that has the perfect amount of violence without detracting from the qualities of a good all-around bike.

The Hyper achieves the excitement part very easily, and in fact has more than any other bike I've ridden. The downside is it gives up other things like comfort.

The XR seems to tick all the boxes for me personally, but I still need to ride it more. The only real downside is the cost, though it worked out to around $2k more than my SP was once all the CA taxes and document fees were handled.

I could go on but I won't jump to any conclusions yet. The honeymoon period is dangerous lol.
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Old June 26th, 2017, 10:41 PM   #44
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3 bikes interest me: The 690 duke, the AT, and the Rally Raid cb500x.

The duke is minimalist, and to my eye the white one is a beauty. Not sure I trust KTM for durability.

The RR Honda could be a true rtw machine. Had a cb500f, and like most Hondas, the sum was greater than the parts and it was a wonderful machine.

The AT is interesting, but big. Never ridden one, but I don't think it would be boring.

I'm still happy with my strada, as is my bank, but as used machines pop up, you never know.

and the Husky 701...
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Old July 5th, 2017, 07:29 AM   #45
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I was not a fan of the Tiger 800. Seemed super wimpy and uninspiring. Didn't seem to have any huge reason to have one instead of the hyper. I'd have liked to try the AT though. I hate Honda but I'd own an Africa Twin for sure.
No "adventure" bike will ever compare to the HS simply because the HS is not an adventure bike. I'm slowly accepting that if I want something that is fun and capable off-road, I'll be giving up a lot.
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Old August 4th, 2017, 05:51 AM   #46
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Appears BMW greatly over-produced the 2016 XR which means extreme discounts available on new 2016 XRs. Walking in the door of a dealer I was told $3,500 off.

The BMW that retains the value the best remains the GS and especially the GSA.
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Old August 4th, 2017, 10:46 AM   #47
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Appears BMW greatly over-produced the 2016 XR which means extreme discounts available on new 2016 XRs. Walking in the door of a dealer I was told $3,500 off.

The BMW that retains the value the best remains the GS and especially the GSA.
Yep. I thought I got a decent price at about $5k off retail. Friend of mine got $8k off retail just 2 months later. They're basically giving them away to make room for the 2018.
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Old August 4th, 2017, 06:28 PM   #48
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BMW had a lot of 2016 XRs, and was discounting them $5,000 to dealers to promote sales. Now, the shelves are empty of 2016s at BMW NA.

To get $8K is suspicious as that would be $3,000 out of the dealer's pocket.

I got this information from a dealer friend.
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Old August 5th, 2017, 11:32 PM   #49
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I thought I'd give you guys a rundown after 1,000 miles on the new bike. Here are some direct comparisons to the Hyper, for anyone interested.

So far, the only thing I have done to the bike is add a taller, rounder seat and do the break-in service.

Engine
The power delivery of the S1000XR and Hyper 821 is actually quite similar. Both engines are peaky and exciting. The Hyper really picks up around 7,000RPM and pulls strongly to redline at 10k. Similarly, the XR picks up around 9,000RPM and pulls strongly to redline at 12k. I think the Hyper has a bit more low end grunt coming out of turns, and more tractable power due to the v-twin power pulses. Meanwhile, the XR is electric smooth and pulls decently from any speed, but really comes alive at the higher RPMs. The XR engine is perfectly smooth all the way down to 1500RPM. You can literally be in 6th gear at 25mph, fully open the throttle, and it will accelerate without a hiccup.

During fun mountain riding, the Hyper gets around 43mpg and the XR gets around 34mpg. When I was doing a lot of highway riding, the Hyper got upwards of 48-49mpg, and apparently the XR can get up to 38-39mpg. Pretty big difference here. Although the XR carries another gallon of fuel, and almost the entire capacity is usable. Some BMW riders have quoted 200 miles range max. I believe the Hyper can do 180 tops? It doesn't matter to me as I usually fill up and take a break at around 120 miles anyway.

The engine on the XR, while smooth, is not smooth. It's an unbalanced inline-4, so it does vibrate at certain RPMs. This manifests itself as a high frequency 'buzz' at certain speeds, which can be felt through the seat, pegs, and handlebars. The handlebar vibration is noticeable at normal cruising RPMs (4000-5000), while the peg and seat vibration is only noticeable at high RPMs. The Hyper on the other hand is very smooth, and any vibration that comes through the bike is of a lower frequency, and therefore less annoying. The only time I find the Hyper to vibrate is at higher speeds on the highway, but I don't spend a lot of time there anyway.

Both bikes sound amazing in their own way. The Hyper emits this thunderous roar and it's quite beautiful to be honest. It sold me on the bike, and it's one of the best sounding bikes (from the riding cockpit) I have ever ridden. On the contrary, the XR is highly mechanical. It emits this whirlwind of noise, from a ridiculously loud (almost obnoxious) intake howl on acceleration, a screaming gear noise, and F1-sounding exhaust note. It sounds more like a weird space ship than a motorcycle. Despite how insane it sounds, it is not soothing or relaxing at all. It's like it's constantly saying "go faster, go faster, go faster", while on the Hyper you can literally chug along and enjoy the beautiful rhythmic pulses from the engine.

I've long applauded the Hyper for its transmission. For me, it's perfect. There is just enough click between gears, without being so chunky that you can miss shifts or fall into false neutrals. It's also very easy to find neutral. The XR transmission almost feels like a video game controller, as though you aren't actually moving the mechanical bits of the transmission. Fitted from the factory with an electronic up and down quickshifter, it takes all the skill out of shifting. Just hit it up and down, and it does everything for you - cutting throttle and blipping for downshifts. The amount of movement required at the shift lever is almost undetectable. It allows you to shift very, VERY fast, while having more stable braking and smoother inputs all around. However this design makes finding neutral very difficult because they can't allow too much space between gears. The XR has a closer ratio gearbox, meaning 1st gear is taller on the XR and 6th gear is shorter, and the difference between gears is very small - I often can't tell if I'm in 2nd or 4th gear when riding around casually.


Electronics
There is no doubt that the XR takes the cake here. The Hyper electronics feel archaic in comparison. The XR takes data from accelerometers, suspension travel sensors, and wheel speed sensors. The Hyper takes data from wheel speed sensors only. The result is that the traction control and ABS function far better on the XR. They intervene more smoothly, and they allow you to be even more ham-fisted in your inputs. It's honestly hard to screw up on this thing - it almost feels unreal (common theme with this bike).

The XR has 4 ride modes - rain, road, dynamic, and dynamic pro. Basically it's just varying levels of traction control and ABS. Also, rain and road modes are detuned to provide less power. These modes are not customizeable like they are on the Hyper. I have found it to be fine though, and I usually ride in Dynamic mode, which is equivalent to sport mode on the Hyper.

Also the XR has cruise control, but I don't plan on using it much.


Chassis
I have the Hyper SP, which is different than the strada, so take this comparison with that in mind. After dialing it in, the Hyper SP Marzocchi/Ohlins suspension setup is pretty damn good. It absorbs bumpy roads relatively well, and handles the twisty mountain roads with scalpel like precision. Of course, there must be a compromise because the setup you want on a smooth race track is not what you want on a pothole ridden back road. I've dialed it in to be a very good compromise though, and the 7 inches of travel really does make a nicer ride. The one area that is still weak on the Hyper is composure - going over very bumpy roads, the bike tends to get upset and lose its line. This could be due to a number of things - geometry, damping, weight, or lack of a steering damper. The XR, by blessing or by curse, has only two suspension settings - hard and soft. It uses electrical signals to adjust the damping rates from and rear automatically. As a tinkerer with OCD, I have nothing to mess with now, and one less thing on my mind. The soft suspension setting is still what sporty, and the hard setting is quite stiff indeed. I would prefer the two settings to be more different, but I've found it to work as advertised.

On the highway, the XR is the clear winner. It is very stable and smooth. The wind doesn't knock you around, and it's not fatiguing at all. I have never liked cruising at 80mph for very long on the Hyper due to the wind, vibrations, and twitchy handling. The XR provides better wind protection without buffeting.

On the back mountain roads, these bikes provide two very different experiences. I can confidently say the XR is a faster, more capable, and safer machine. However, the Hyper is without a doubt more fun. This is a very subjective thing, but no motorcycle has ever made me giggle as much as the Hyper as it wildly wheelies and makes beautiful sounds. While going quick on the XR, it's more like sheer amazement because I don't understand how it's physically possible to do the things it's doing. Scary, really. It's just not normal.

The brakes on the XR are incredible. The best I have ever used, hands down. They are linked front to rear through the ABS module, and I believe it is also linked to the suspension - so when you brake hard with the front brake, it stiffens the front suspension to prevent brake dive. It's hard to describe really. The Hyper brakes are damn good, but the XR is on a completely different level of power, modulation, and chassis stability.

Ergonomics
On the Hyper, you sit on top of the bike up near the front tire. On the XR, you sit much further back and more inside the bike. I have learned over time that I prefer sitting in the bike, but sitting on top of the bike is also quite the experience and makes you feel in command of the motorcycle rather than just along for the ride. After changing to a taller seat on the XR, the ergonomics are great for my 6 foot, 34 inch inseam body. The XR feels more open due to reaching out to the bars rather than straight down in front of you. The peg to seat distance on both bikes is similar.

Overall
Overall, these bikes provide very different riding experiences, and yet they are not as different as you might think. I bought the XR to be a high performance touring bike - something I could still have fun on while railing twisty mountain roads, but also have the ability to go a long distance. After riding it, it is clear that it is definitely biased more towards sport rather than touring. I am not sure I would want to do a long touring trip with lots of highway on the XR. Perhaps a medium distance trip consisting of mostly mountain roads and 200-400 mile days. It has more highway prowess than the Hyper, but less than a true sport tourer such as an ST, FJR, RT, etc.

On any given day if I'm looking for a bike to tool around on for fun, the Hyper still is best. Nothing can match the experience it provides. While the XR excels in most categories at being a high performance bike, it is missing something that makes the Hyper special.
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Old August 6th, 2017, 03:23 PM   #50
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Good contrast, thanx...it's just got'ta be a twin for me...
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